I’d never interviewed anyone before, so it was nice that Ron was to be my first victim and we emailed to arrange a meeting place and decided on the pub. Well, as the facebook meme states, no good story ever began with ‘we were having a cup of tea…’ We decided on The Crown, a pub local to both of us with a fine reputation for Guinness. We arrived, said hello and sat down at a table right under the dart board, noticing out of the corners of our eyes that there were a number of dark suited men stood along the bar. Other than them and us, it was, as they say, dead. It slowly dawned on us that we had inadvertently happened upon the wake of a regular of the pub…a darts player who had sadly, quite literally died on the oche. Luckily for us, we weren’t sitting in his final spot, he’d died during an away game at another pub.
So salubrious a beginning!
Talking to Ron Scowcroft is easy, keeping note is another matter, we chatted all evening about poetry, life, politics, anything and everything and my carefully jotted down questions stayed in their unopened notebook and my pen stayed in my handbag. Thing is, Ron is such a good egg, you literally could chat to him all night. Not only is he a good egg, he’s also a superb poet, an opinion shared by many including George Szirtes. What struck me in talking to Ron about poetry is his craftsmanship, this is a poet who manages the impossible, rendering poetry that feels fresh and resonant but which is beautifully made without revealing the labour.
Me: Can you describe how you write?
RS: A poem might begin with a single word, phrase, a list of associated ideas or random thoughts. I usually type up a list at first and try to resist too much structure, usually there are scraps of paper around with half formed ideas. Often they go into a ‘working copies’ folder. I like the idea of moving between different poems- I know a painter who works like that, with two or three canvases on the go at the same time. If I know how to begin, I struggle to finish, and if I know how to end, I struggle to start. Trouble is, when I find a solution, I’m normally doing something else- driving, walking without a pen to hand, at the cinema.
Me: Why do you write and when did you start writing?
Ron: I find it’s the most natural type of written expression for me, bit of a cliché, but I think poetry chooses you, a very personal thing initially, like others I suppose, I react to the turmoil life throws at me: love, betrayal, belief or lack of it, death, loss, friendship, self awareness…it’s making sense of the world. Not that poetry necessarily brings answers.
I started writing in my early twenties – relationships, some political poems (Thatcher was in power – you just had to react). I used to read at the ‘Why Not’ pub in Liverpool, dingy cellar near the docks. On the first visit, think I’d got two short poems when a friend booked us both in for the next month’s guest spots (we can do that!!!) Brian Jacques was there (he went on to write children’s books- The Mossflower series). Read at George’s Hall later, I always wonder if Carol Ann Duffy was around.
Me: Ahh, talking of the Laureate, which poets do you admire?
RS: Lancaster has several accomplished writers, many of them with prize-winning collections: Mike Barlow, Elizabeth Burns, Carole Coates, Jane Routh, Ian Seed. I like Jean Sprackland, she can take everyday observations and make them into something haunting, unusual – dumped mattresses like sloshed housewives, cows crossing a bridge above the motorway, eyes like planets – images that stay with you. Michael Symmons Roberts’ ‘Corpus’ is amazing, tight and original.
Then there are the greats – William Blake, Larkin (love the poems, hate the man), Coleridge….
Me: Though I dislike the division, do you consider yourself a ‘page’ or ‘performance’ poet?
RS: I enjoy watching performance poetry but I couldn’t do it myself. Voice and pace are important though. When I read before an audience, I get a better idea of whether a piece feels right. I like to hear writers give a little of themselves – the background to a poem, a context. I believe that if people are paying good money to see you, you ought to entertain, vary your material, try to create a rapport.
My worst performance was at a student bar when the victorious rugby team came in half way through, second worst was a reading with Edge Hill College Poetry Circus (yes, it was the Monty Python era) at a school in Rochdale, year 11, Friday afternoon…the staff left us to it!
My best was at Derwent Festival with Templar, it was a great weekend, lots of top quality stuff and I got to meet lots of people I really admire…check out Wendy Klein’s ‘Cuba in the Blood’. Wendy left America in the 60s as a protest against the Vietnam War and I don’t think she ever went back!
Me: Many people talk about the difficulties of getting their poetry published, have you any advice for them?
RS: People I know who’ve gone through the official process – editor, publishing house, contracts – work really hard. I think you need to go for the magazines that suit your style and subject matter. Magazines such as ‘New Writer’ and ‘Frogmore Papers’ will take a chance on people who are just breaking through. Flax has always been a great for promoting regional poetry. It helps to have been placed in a competition, but competitions can get expensive. In my opinion Vanity Publishing is usually a rip-off.
Me: Where do you go from here?
RS: I’m hoping the ideas keep on coming. A pamphlet would be great. A follow up to the Dukes’ Peninsula Exhibition of poetry and painting with John Morrison. Getting to hear other poets performing. Meeting with creative folk – nothing beats it!
Me: Natural World or Society?
RS: Both!
But the way things are going, you’ve got to engage. I don’t want to be writing about Old Albion when the world’s going to hell in a handcart.
Poetry at its best connects, the dark stuff – selfishness, violence, decay as well as the more positive aspects of human relationships.
Me: Lager or Guinness?
RS: Guinness.
Me: Yes please, I’ll have another pint!
Ron will hopefully be reading at a launch of Cake #3 at Lancaster University sometime in the New Year.
More news on the art collaboration front with John Morrison. John has two exhibitions planned for next year – one at the Corner House, Liverpool and one at Liverpool Hope University where he is now artist in residence. Some of the paintings are based on Ron’s poems from the ‘Peninsula’ series. I’m also pleased to learn that, in a presentation to the Arts Council in London next week, he will be talking about his and Ron’s collaboration as part of an ‘Artists to Artists’ lecture.
Rachel McGladdery is a poet living and writing in rural Lancashire. She has 4 children and a growing menagerie. She writes in an intimate style about the things and people that surround her. Rachel regularly performs at live literature events around the North West and has both poetry and reviews widely published online, in anthologies (the latest being Best of Manchester Poets vol 2) and in magazines. She won the Lennon Poet 2010 competition, awarded by Carol Ann Duffy and enjoys facilitating school workshops. She is currently working on her first collection and a package of poetry source material for use in schools and would love to hear from prospective publishers willing to offer HUGE sums of money in order to stop her from having to get a proper job. She dislikes talking about herself in the 3rd person.